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JUNE 10, 2012 10:31PM

On having to give a SS number to set up a tent and camp

Rate: 33 Flag

 

 

"Step on up here and we'll get the process started" is what the camp host lady said Friday afternoon. 

We'd pulled into what Me and Eli used to affectionately call the ghetto campground, an acre or so of cleared land with fire pits and tables where we, many times, had set up our modest camps. Mostly, it was convenient as there is a boat ramp at the other end of the lot and the fishing there is often good. We weren't too picky about the 'accommodations.'

When they added a pit toilet was when we pretty much quit going there. There was and still is a real bathroom with running water, flush toilets and showers just a short walk away at the NON-PRIMITIVE area. Seemed to us that those representing the RV contingent lobbied for the stinky pit to keep the tent people away from the beautiful campers. 

Back in better days, a volunteer camp attendant would come through the primitive camp in the evening to collect the 7 bucks or so for camp fee. They'd scribble out a PAID receipt that we'd post near the tent.

But, now there is a bright yellow sign that says, "CHECK IN WITH THE CAMP HOST (look for the $80,000 recreational vehicle) at the adjacent area.

So, being good citizens, and all for avoiding hassles, that's where me and my mate went.

"Process?" was my reply... "there is, a, cough.. process, for camping?"

"Well sir, yes, kind of." At least she called me sir as I was bid entry into the south wing of the rolling mega complex as my girlfriend waited in the hot vehicle.

"OK I'll need your name" she said as she hunched over her laptop, me standing behind her feeling like I was being set up for probation. Flashback of unpleasant memories!

"Steve"

She turned around then, pushing her glasses down her nose to peer over them at me with a muffled but distinct sigh of displeasure.

"Last name please."

"Oh, it's just Steve.. like Madonna, or Sting, or Moby. Just Steve- well the JUST isn't part of it. One word, one name, STEVE"

She wasn't buying that BS and it was in fact a lie so I finally, reluctantly, gave up the 411 she wanted.

But then, "street address?"

"Uh, excuse me if I sound, eh, rather exasperated here, about your 'process' but what does my street address have to do with me camping here overnight?" (I pays you cash ok dragon lady)

She wasn't about to budge on the address thing though; said it was "a field that could NOT be left incomplete." Otherwise the 'puterized form set up by homeland security would reject me as potential camper/loser/possible threat.

So I told her "350 5th ave, New York, New York" which is of course the Empire State Building. All in fun of course but she'd seen my Kansas license plate and wasn't going for it. In fact she became noticably agitated and started shuffling her feet around under her makeshift desk. I peered under there, wondering if there might be a red buzzer button, foot operated, for her to step on in panic situations, like say, this.

Hell, went ahead and gave her my old address, the one that was foreclosed by BoA. Not that I have anything to hide because I don't. . just that I don't see where my damned address is any of her, or homeland security's biz.

But then it got worse! 

"Social Security number please Mr. O'hehir"

"HUH?" I was near to blowing a fuse! "Why the helfruck do you think you need my social? I assure you I'm a citizen of the home land. My great great grandpa got forty acres and a mule, farmed the dirt and made babies, AMERICAN babies. It's a long story. Would you like a copy of my family tree?"

Clearly growing frustrated as I could discern from her flushed face and sweaty brow, she replied with another not so muffled sigh- "this is a new program put in place by the state to catch deadbeat Dads... and Moms." She added the MOMS I guess so as to not be considered possibly gender discriminate.

"You don't have to tell me the social. I'll turn my head while you type it in and all I can see after is asterisks."

All I wanted to do was launch my boat with my baby and go fishing, navigating the lake in errant fashion whilst drinking, so I agreed, then typed in 666-66-6666, keeping one eye on her to make sure she didn't peek.

"There we go, all finished. Now that wasn't so bad was it!"

"No worse than a root canal . . . so, if I'm a dead beat dad I can be expecting a visit at my camp later this evening?"

Scornful face. No answer. . . 

 

 

The camp was full of really marginal people, us being the exception.

Here's a movie, mostly made to capture the noise at around ten that night which was ridiculous. If you have good sound turn up the volume and listen. The stuff we go through for fun! Might have to find some different fun, or at least a different place to go.. . .  .    .      .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Did I just read the True Confession Story where you and a certain someone celebrated your honeymoon??????

AND I WASN'T INVITED!!?!?!?!?

Blasphemy!!!

~hiss~

~walks off stage~
ss number to catch deadbeat dads, huh?

yeah, right.

social fucking security number to go camping.

what if you were canadien? then what the fuck?

my word of the day is fuck.

fuck fuck fuck.

and bullshit.

unbelievable. i will say i dont have it memorized, when i go. what will they do? kick me out?
Keep this post up. I'll use it for reference. . . .
Uncle Chri ain't rating? Use it for a reference if you will!!! A reference on how to write? With permission I might allow that.

Hi Tinky and Jane... yeah, what's civilization coming too. Over regulation I'd say. That's why I'm voting mormon this fall.
Nano and I were wondering what took you so dam long in the hostesses with the mostesses fabo trailer.

The SS requirement is absurd. Yet another ineffectual slacker dad (cause you know its always the dads) tool. Yes I said tool.

Oh tinker tink tink. I have a grand plan for the honeymoon, I'll pm you!
OK. . rated. . .

It's not often one finds a complaint about regulation on OS. You get Uncle's award for a Profile in Courage.
Gee thanks Uncle!! What's next.. digital ID cards that tell the homeland where we are at at all times, like... cell phones? I'm all about Romney. He will turn this regulation thing around!

Hi baby you were a good sport . . . in spite of. We ain't going there no mo!
Tool? Heehee
"Your realize Mr. O'hehir that along with your SSN we now require documentation of a successful bicycle face plant? It's a required field, you see."

"oh, and stop trying to look up my dress you disgusting Perv!"
What seems weird--I mean genuinely weird to me--is how CAMPING is now associated with deadbeat dads (and moms). Would it now be the modus operandi of the average deadbeat to simply abscond via extended camping trips?
This world is bizarre, and this country sucks.
Welcome to the land of the not so free anymore...unless you work for a southern drug cartel...then I guess you can do what ever you want.
Nice fire, but did you have to pay extra for the EPA greenhouse gas permit?
Dear Amy, I have in fact completed successful bicycle face plants several times, but not since I was eleven or so, but, NO DOCUMENTATION! So I might be SOL
I have already (cyber) looked up your dress many times, and I likes what I sees. Call me a perv if you will. Been called worse!

PW "Would it now be the modus operandi of the average deadbeat to simply abscond via extended camping trips?"
Seems so!!!

tai HI.. AM considering joining a cartel where one can kill and hack with a sense of true freedom

jmac.. the new PRIMITIVE (like me) camp fee is 8 bucks, BUT, there is a three dollar first night fee added, which may go for greenhouse gas stuff. We do make camp fires after all.
When requested I always use my wife's SS number. I have promised her that I'll visit her at GITMO when they take her away.
"...deadbeat Dads...and Moms." Good one.
Rated.
FYI, Joisey's SS# is 489-36-0922. Feel free to hand it to whomever you meet!

Name: Joe Taliban
Address: Mosque of the Holy Bomb
City: One with tall buildings
SS#: Countdown to Armageddon

And don't forget to ask if she has any spare C4 detonators lying around because you're not sure you brought enough.
navigating the lake in an errant fashion whilst drinking with your baby... sounds kinda shifty. They shoulda probably run a credit check too. :-)
Scylla, thanks for visiting and laughing out loud here. Better the wife at gitmo I always say :D

cheshyre- allah all you akbar, and all that. All purpose social, noted! c4 detonators should be provided anyway... in case.

psb.. shifty is ME... NOT. I am not shifty! Damnet!!! But, why not a credit check at the door? Seems apropos
Man, you've just gotta get up to Midway, Canada, one of these days. The provincial park is right on the edge of the Kettle river - about a hundred yards from the American border. The camping "procedure" is awesome.... pick a spot and set up camp.

Someone may be around to collect the $15 fee later. If they don't show up, you're asked to leave the fee in the box on the table inside. The box is made of wood. It is small. It is not locked. You open it up, drop your money in on top of the other people's money and go on with your camping.
;-)
.
soon my babies... soon... soon we will be subjected to random stops and demands to see our papers.

oh wait...that happened here just last week on a main street in my neighborhood. nevermind...
This is exactly why I hate camping. All the questions, the endless, interminable questions.
A social security number to camp????
Yike.
We've camped all over the country and I've not had that happen before...not a good sign.
Oregon still just has the metal box, pay with cash or check (!) only or they knock on the tent/truck/tarp with a rope between two trees at dawn...
Let us know if you're taking a road trip out west, we'll get the campfire going : )
There is just no civilization anymore. Soon the fees will rise to pay for the paperwork and your picture taken by the CCTV will be posted at the gate to deny you access from your misinformation. Just be sure that the SS# you buy on the internet has good credit. Oh, and take a disco soundtrack with you to drown out the clowns. You won't have to play it very long to drive them away.
(Ghetto Camping Employee Handbook, Section 7, Camp Host Situations "Handling Undesirable Potential Guests")

"In the event that an undesirable person or persons attempts to register at the campground, pepper them with a long series of annoying questions in the hope that they will leave of their own free will. If this attempt fails, point the blowers of the hidden underground venting system for the pit toilet to said person's campsite."
I have walked away from retail stores when they ask me for my SS just to get their stupid credit cards to get a discount...The last onetold me it happens a lot lately that people object.

And what's Tink going on about? Honeymoon?
Hrmph! I read somewhere official, that your social security number is NOT to be used for identification and you are within your rights to refuse to give it out as such. I would report it to the Forest Service or whomever is the governing body of the camp. Hope you had fun, tho.
You might get more peace and quiet if you pitched your tent in a Manhattan back alley....all that was missing from your film was a guy pulling up on his Harley!
Years ago and living in LA I went to a campground not far from the city and noticed a ranger packing heat. He told me about some of the things he had to get in between - people taking down other campers' tents and putting up their own, etc. - and I thought, this ain't my father's campground. Like Twain said, "Man is the only animal that blushes, or needs to."
(whatta buncha knuckleheads)

No commenter so far has chuckled at the last name you gave the camp host(ess). I did. Funny stuff.

Gotta love the continued spread of misinformation on OS. This time the guest speaker is M...Roybal with her statement "I read somewhere official ... ". Uh huh.

UncleChris ... I'm with you, brother. These progressive-types don't understand that the scenario played-out above is exactly what will happen when the government is involved in every aspect of peoples' lives.

Want to camp for a subsidized, low-cost? Sure -- give us all of your ID information so we can run your name through our databases to see if you're a law-abiding citizen and to check-out if there's a way to collect any unpaid child support.

Want public-option, goverment-provided healthcare? Sure -- provide every single aspect of your medical history and piss into this jar so we can put your information into our diagnosis algorithm to calculate the best prevention/treatment regimens.

Yep. Numbskulls don't even understand the implications of their proposed socialism.
Well, Mr. O'Hehir. I see they have you RIGHT where they want you. RRRRR for unbelievable and scary. PS I'm watching you from the web cam they set up.
It's been a requirement out this way for a long time to get a fishing license. Same reason given. The fish and wildlife depaartment here says it started in the Clinton era as an aspect of a program to find deadbeats. What about bowling alleys? Isn't renting shoes a clue?
the concept of someone owning an $80,000 RV, and driving around to spend the night in trashy campgrounds is just so odd.

am i missing something here?
Welcome back, Balt. now-cookie-past-nipple! I like "Double Stuff" the best.
Good morning. Finally rained last night and sure needed that.

Kansas is perennially Republican. 100% guaranteed to vote (electoral college and all) R for prez every single time. Usually too, they/we are all for live and let live and stay out of people's business until necessary, so I was amazed about the new 'process.' Not happily amazed either as you can tell.

The camp host (oreo) literally stays planted in one spot for the whole season. Usually retirees that are compensated by free camping or maybe a small pittance of $$$. Pretty odd really.

Funny and insightful comments all. Thanks much.
My aunt is a retired park ranger. Name, address, ID/DL and SSN are required at state and federal camping facilities for security purposes.

Wonder what would've happened if you threw off the last digit of your SS#. ;)
Security for the home land! It is required!!!

Fuck that
Welcome to Capitalism 3.0 -- I hope you gave them Mitt's social security number
The connection with deadbeat dads and camping? We are at the beginning stages of the 21st Century version of Grapes of Wrath, where the deadbeats, the jobless and the homeless will more and more be forced to live in their vehicles. And no doubt, desperate people can be dangerous people.

That's what I meant with my allusion to Capitalism 3.0, just in case Uncle Chri (the rtwing version of Big Brother) thot I was off my meds.
Legal requirements to provide your SSN -
http://ssa-custhelp.ssa.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/78/~/legal-requirements-to-provide-your-ssn

No mention of camp grounds in the list though there is of child support.
Nerd ... nice job ... 'cept most ADHD OSers here won't copy, paste, and view the link ... here are the pertinent parts of your link

- - - - - - - - - -

Specific laws require a person to provide his or her SSN for certain purposes. While we cannot give you a comprehensive list of all situations where an SSN might be required ... (here are some examples)

•States for child support enforcement;

If a business or other enterprise asks you for your SSN, you can refuse to give it. However, that may mean doing without the purchase or service for which your number was requested.

Giving your SSN is voluntary, even when you are asked for the number directly. If requested, you should ask why your SSN is needed, how your number will be used, what law requires you to give your number and what the consequences are if you refuse. The answers to these questions can help you decide if you want to give your Social Security number. The decision is yours.
Me, I won't be camping there again.

If it should happen that other campgrounds (like my favorite
at Melvern Lake where we've been several times this year and never asked), I will refuse and possibly make a scene, for whatever that is worth. Yeah sure, deadbeat parents- the enforcement of making support payments is a good cause I suppose, but I'll be protesting on grounds of privacy.
Tr ig doesn't say whether it's a private or state campground. Either way, is the state of KS be contracting child support enforcement to campgrounds? I thought KS was one of those R small government places ...
Toilet wishes and hot shower dreams. (First dibs on the screenplay? Improv too?)
So, I was going to make a funny, charming comment but the legal research gene asserted its dominance, and I had to look up the fucking law. As with any law, especially federal law that intersects with local law, there are many laws that have to be considered together. The Social Security Administration website publishes a timeline of SS-related laws from the inception of SS to 2009 (I guess they ran out of personnel to update it).

First, there is the SS Privacy Act of 1994, Public Law (P.L.) 93-579, Section 7, 88 Stat. 1909:

"(a)(1) It shall be unlawful for any Federal, State or
local government agency to deny to any individual any right,
benefit, or privilege provided by law because of such
individual's refusal to disclose his social security account
number.

"(2) the provisions of paragraph (1) of this subsection
shall not apply with respect to --

"(A) any disclosure which is required by Federal
statute, or

"(B) the disclosure of a social security number to any
Federal, State, or local agency maintaining a
system of records in existence and operating
before January 1, 1975, if such disclosure was
required under statute or regulation adopted prior
to such date to verify the identity of an
individual.

(There was nothing in federal law previous to the Privacy Act about child support--that came in 1996. It is doubtful that Kansas had a law about SS numbers in campsites before 1975.)

"(b) Any Federal, State, or local government agency which
requests an individual to disclose his social security
account number shall inform that individual whether that
disclosure is mandatory or voluntary, by what statutory or
other authority such number is solicited, and what uses will
be made of it."

This law is still on the books. As other commenters mentioned, this is a general SS policy. You have to be told if the requirement is mandatory or voluntary, what law authorizes it, and what will happen if you refuse. SS Admin website also suggests that if there is an alternative to using the SS number, the party requesting it should use an alternative.

The federal law that authorized the use of SS numbers for the purpose of collecting child support was passed in 1996. From the timeline:

"Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Reconciliation Act of 1996 (P.L. 104-193) (Welfare Reform ):...Section 317 provided that State child support enforcement procedures require the SSN of any applicant for a professional license, commercial driver's license, occupational license, or marriage license be recorded on the application. The SSN of any person subject to a divorce decree, support order, or paternity determination or acknowledgement would have to be placed in the pertinent records. SSNs are required on death certificates."

This "Clinton era" law does not mandate the use of SS numbers for the purpose of collecting child support for any but licenses relating to work (and SS was always required for work) as well as in cases where child support is a direct issue, such as divorce or paternity cases.

So, while the 1996 law does not actually *forbid* the use of SS numbers at campgrounds, it does not mandate that states expand their gathering of SS numbers in random situations. The 1974 Privacy Act, still on the books, says that states can only ask for SS numbers based on identity laws already on the books by Jan 1, 1975.

Obviously this is not a comprehensive review of SS law, especially since I'm supposed to be working on housing law at the moment. But it sure looks like this should not be a *mandatory* demand for a campsite, though nothing prevents anyone, private or government, from asking for an SS number voluntarily.

I wonder if anyone gives their correct social, and if that makes the fish bite more or less.
Tanks for that SL!
yo it was not too bad.
as dylan sang, in 'sugar baby'
'aint no limit to the amount of trouble
a woman can bring'

for she cares. truly. for rules, and u.


oh go in mellow like my sis's new
camping beau does..

fuck controversy.

it hit me in the tummy..
That is so bizarre. We are truly living in a police state. Campgrounds aren't even off limits now for ID. Big Brother is everywhere.
harrowing shit, as they say.
the way of the world.

what is that, again? i forget........
oh yes
trying times...when men are men and women women maybe
i hope, cuz both are equally horny, smart , and silly.
so bring on the End.
The end? Yeah bring it! There's a certain comfort in not caring.

I've had optic-rectosis for years, self diagnosed.

It's when the optic nerve, somehow, becomes attached
to the rectum, giving the sufferer a shitty outlook.

I jest really. My life is good. Won't let big brother get me down.
When you don't care any more, they've lost the upper hand.
truer words never spoken, trig.
indifference. not an unholy one, though.
a holy kinda indifference like those boo-dists
and zen master tricksters.
ha.
Thanks to Serenita for checking it out. I knew I was right when I threw my tizzy fit in the local mega-low-mart spewing indignation at the minimum wage employee who had nothing to do with asking for my SSN nor any capability of changing it..I just didn't know why for sure. The clerk on the other hand knew that if if I did not calm down and quit showing her the part on my original SSN card now 35+ years old that said "Not to be Used for Identifiaction Purposes" that I wasn't getting a fishing license. grrrrrr
funny as I read comments (aka you fool!)... listening to "the police" channel on pandora. The irony grabbed me just now
Very funny! And sad that you can't go CAMPING without an SS number. Oh, well, now you and the trees are legit.
Hey FLA. Cool you visited tit for tat. . lol hahaha. It is funny isn't it, truth -- who needs fiction?

I was once cuffed to a picnic table at the same campground, hell, maybe same table..
A camp neighbor and his lady friend offered a bowl. I was fairly out of it already, didn't even hit it, but was holding it in my right hand thinking about it, when a dude appeared over my shoulder . . . a walking camp ranger who had spied, apparently!
Said "what is that in your hand?!?" so I held up my left hand which had a bic lighter so he said "OTHER HAND!!!" and I showed him the pipe. The subterfuge foiled. So cuffed me to the damned table while the camp neighbors totally didn't explain it WAS THEIR PIPE... and WEED, the bit that was in there.
So he lectured us, threatened charges but "let us go" an hour or so later, after which the neighbors packed and left at 11pm.
And what you ask? I returned? Yeah, many times. I is stoopid!!
Wow. Sounds like they're working to make Hillsdale even more of a hellhole than it already was.
For a second I was having visions of Tom Joad reading this.
Asking for the SS sounds like BS but what's next, indeed.
Internment camps?

Down with Big Brother
Down with Big Brother
Jaysus Sheeit. Utter BS.