I met Nancy in a three-week program we both attended last December. It was for women only, specifically, women who wanted to change their lives. Nancy sat across from me and I liked her right away. Of all the women there, she seemed the most like me. She was about my age, had a similar background and was also a suburban mother. She had wide gray eyes, a toothy white smile and was warm and friendly.
She was also supremely confident, relentlessly positive and talked a blue streak.
When I found out she was Catholic I decided we should be friends. When I found out she went to Mass every single day, said the rosary regularly and prayed for everyone in class, I was in awe. Maybe if I hung around her she’d get me closer to heaven, by association.
Early on, she let it be known she was pro-life and the instructor had to ask her to keep her views to herself. She murmured, "Sorry," and crossed herself. I decided I better keep quiet about my own feelings on the subject since I liked her; I didn't want it to get in the way of a potential friendship. I know plenty of people who feel the same way as Nancy. I could live with a disagreement like that.
But there were other things.
Once she asked me if I did yoga.
"Only in my mind," I replied.
"Well don't ever do it for real. Yoga is against the teachings of the Church. It gives demons direct access to the soul."
She was a former nurse. She mentioned she couldn’t go back to nursing anymore because even though hospitals don’t make a policy of stating it, they’re all pro-choice and regularly perform abortions.
So she had a few quirky ideas, I told myself. I don’t mind quirky.
When the program ended, Nancy and I agreed to keep in touch. We decided to get together once a week and support each other in our quest for change. I couldn't wait; the program was great but it was highly structured and there wasn’t a lot of time for chitchat. It would be nice to talk informally, without the constraints of time and nailing down objectives.
We met at a restaurant after the first of the year. We ordered and then got down to business. I was anxious to find out if she'd been working on changing.
"Margaret, want to take a leap of faith?" Nancy asked me as she leaned across the table and stared at me with those huge gray eyes.
"Uh, I'm not wearing the right shoes for that, Nance."
"No silly," she laughed. "What I mean is, there's going to be an anti-abortion rally in D.C. soon and I thought you might want to go with me. I get the feeling you're not pro-life. Miracles happen at these things. It'll change you, I know it will."
"I'm sorry but I'm not interested," I said, deliberately taking a gulp of my burning hot coffee to keep from saying more.
"But babies are being murdered every day. And do you know what they do with them? They make vaccines out of their flesh. Out of their flesh, Margaret!"
“That is just not true,” I said. Now I was alarmed.
She practically lunged across the table at me. "Oh yes it is, I can tell you where to get the information, I can give you websites. If the public only knew half the things I do, there would never be another abortion and no one would get their kids vaccinated either."
Then she added, "You don’t get your kids vaccinated, do you?"
I stared at her. "Are you crazy? Of course I do."
And she was off. She rattled on about how vaccines were so deadly they actually caused diseases and also autism. It was a conspiracy between the medical and pharmaceutical communities. Doctors and drug company executives didn’t get their kids vaccinated.
She could never be a nurse again because there were certain people she’d decided she couldn’t treat. Like Muslims. It went against her morals to take care of people who hated America and were only here to scam the system. The family was sacred and most of society's problems would go away if women stayed home with their children. If only Sarah Palin were president, she added wistfully.
“Do you listen to Rush Limbaugh? You really should; I learn so much from him,” she said, coming up for air.
This wasn’t the kind of change I was looking for or willing to support.
I looked at my cell phone in desperation. "Oh no, I just remembered, I have to pick up my kids earlier than usual. They have an, um, an early release day."
Nancy was okay with that; she said that gave her time to go back to church and pray for all the unborn babies that were being aborted as we spoke.
As I peeled out of the parking lot, I thought about how for several weeks, I'd allowed myself to be seduced by a well-dressed person with a big white smile and magnetic personality, someone who'd seemed so genuine and principled.
I felt betrayed and a little angry, but not at Nancy.
The class we'd taken together had been heavy on self-analysis but apparently I hadn't dug deeply enough.


Salon.com
Comments
I like it very much, although it sounded a bit parodistic to me, which doesn't matter at all.
R♥
ccdarling: Apparently, a lot of people do. She's not alone.
Jane: Studies show that hearing its mother's voice while in the womb is good for the fetus and promotes a lifelong love of learning so even though you weren't quoting Shakespeare, the words don't matter. And a foul mouth is certainly better than no mouth at all.
Afan Ofyours: You're right about that; most of my friends do not feel the same way I do about the "big" things. And it does make for good stories; in fact there will undoubtedly be more. Because I'm meeting her for lunch again today! With a couple other people. Happy weekend to you too.
I might have to rethink my strategy. Conservativeville doesn't have a great sense of humor.
Disclaimer- the joke was in the context of a guy friend talking about himself and three other guys and their wives going out to dinner, so I said "So if I got a wife I could go?" He gave me a sidelong look. I now know what that looks like.
I'm just a little speechless. People are interesting, aren't they?
"Maybe if I hung around her she’d get me closer to heaven, by association." I've had that feeling too.
You're a good egg, Margaret. ~r
Well told story.
rated with love
So I would have given her the benefit of the doubt, just like you did.
However, I would have felt forced to share that I am in favor of abortions and want them to be as freely available as botox.
That would have cleared things up easily.
~nodding~ So does masturbation and reading books deemed 'offensive' by the Vatican!! ~:D
Oooh and do you know what they do with all them dead fetuses?
THEY MAKE THEM INTO HAMBURGERS!!!! OH noze!! It true!! Read it on Rush's website!! ~:D
some of the fragments of your own Shadow.
Similar, you two, haunting, hm?
The archetype of the ‘nurse’, the good Catholic lady other Catholic ladies feel comfy with…
Stripped the veneer off the Crazy Nurse,
found some goofy misapprehension of the Mission of the Christ,
might as well mash her
up, metaphorically,
and make an
‘ignorance’
Vaccine outta her.ha.
Yikes, glad she gave up nursing!
So my point is : what you did with Senseless Nancy
WAS
Self analysis.
Now good luck with the comments………
I predict a bit of a fair flare up?!
Or did your mother mix pcp in your formula as a child? Or just basically demented? Dropped on your head? Bizarro, curious, eccentric, far-out, funny, kinky, kooky, odd, outlandish, out-of-the-way, outré, peculiar, quaint, queer, quirky, screwy, strange, wacky, way-out, weird; farcical, laughable, ludicrous, ridiculous; Alice-in-Wonderland, Kafkaesque, nightmarish; bad-dreamlike, surreal?
YES!!!
And the world is FULL OF THEM and they vote... and Ohio is a swing state.
I too think though Margaret that your time wasn't wasted...
love reading of your journey.
Just so you know, I'm trying to get a Men's Club started at the church I attend, and our spiritual leader will be a nun who writes books about golf.
Lezlie
off..
HUGGG
Phyllis: Nancy was born and raised in Chicago which surprised me when I found out; she's only been in C-ville about a year but she fits right in. Now why didn't that clod of a man ask you to join them anyway - is it de rigueur you have a spouse in order to have dinner with them?
Joan: They're what make the world go 'round, that's for sure. And I must admit, I was impressed with the fact that she went to church every day. Not sure why, but I was. I had eggs when we went to lunch and they were very good!
Oryoki: It's very draining to be around people who are constantly spouting their beliefs whether they're in line with my own or not. She left nursing for a variety of reasons, all of which I've heard, all related to her beliefs and she also told a story about a nurse who got fired for praying with a patient who died. Another reason she's not comfortable with the profession anymore.
Myriad: She's got 'em in spades although I've yet to hear her views on homosexuality. Although I'm pretty sure I know them already.
RP: There are a frightening amount of them and some were in that class with us although none as vocal as she was. But when she'd say something, they'd nod their heads. At times the instructor got impatient and had to interject that in the "real world" there are certain things you don't talk about, especially on the job.
Scarlett: Let's do it! The music's way better there too. I had a friend in high school who got bit hard by the Pro-Life bug and Nancy had nothing on her; she became downright scary.
Julie: EEEEEEEKKKKKK, I know!
trilogy: It does, but it sure doesn't make them any less annoying.
dianaani: Outside of the classroom walls, it was definitely creepier than inside when there was a moderator to shush her.
Nick: She does know my views on things and it doesn't matter. She is very fervent in her outlook. And I'm pretty sure if I said what you suggested, she'd tell me aborted fetuses were used in Botox.
Christine: I assumed she'd be different outside of class. And she was. Just not what I was expecting.
Larry: Today! We went to lunch today although there were two other women from the class with us. One of them is severely depressed so she just sits there and that encourages Nancy. But the other one held up her hand every time she started to get going on her favorite subjects and kept her in line.
Lea: I love that: "Faith trumps reason." That is so dangerous. She is an intelligent woman and was a critical care nurse for many years. I don't understand how she could get through a program like that and see the things she must have seen in a big city hospital (Chicago) and still feel the way she does.
Tink: I KNOW! And when you do all three of those things at once (yoga, masturbating and reading offensive books - takes years of practice) it's a free pass to the Dark Side.
I think there's a website to the fetus burger thing called "I Can Has Fetus Cheezburger?"
Seems you have your head and heart in the right place, and don't need any help in getting to where you need to be in life.
Gordon: Sorry to disappoint; her real name isn't Nancy. But I've been meaning to ask, are you by chance related to Donny and Marie and if so could you get their autographs for me?
trig: Are you talking about me or Nancy? Yes Ohio is a very swinging state; we're like a bunch of monkeys here.
Thanks for liking my new "avvy"; they all have names and that one is called "Winter Imitating Spring With Too Long Bangs." There is no deeper meaning there. Soon it will change as it's gotten colder and my bangs have gotten shorter.
John: The only thing I've changed is her name (it's not Nancy). She is very startling in person. We had lunch today actually, not long after I posted this. But two other women joined us and one kept her on a tight leash; she has no patience with this stuff. Good luck with the men's group and the spiritual leader sounds fabulous. I hope you write about it and her.
trig: Gordon is free to say whatever he likes here and I am honored he came all the way from Brazil just to comment on my fluff. If he gets any awards, I hope they will be for "Best Starched Dress Shirt" and "Most Thoughtful Gaze."
As for James, he has no equal and I think of him as the Poet Laureate of OS.
Lezlie: Isn't it funny how no one looks like they should? Serial killers, pedophiles, religious fanatics? It's just not fair that you actually have to get to know people to find out what they're like. :)
Linda: If you're going to hell, what's the point in anyone else trying to be good? Maybe your friend is secretly hoping you'll rub off on her if she keeps emailing you.
Firechick: Nope, not fiction. Although if you met her you'd probably think you just stepped into a book!
greenheron: I really don't know how she feels deep down because I don't know her well enough but she speaks with such certainty and conviction that she seems to really believe she has the answers. Maybe it does feel like a relief to convince yourself you have all the answers but to me it would also seem to lead to a scary complacency and an insular mindset. From what I know of her she doesn't question things and forms her opinions around her faith. It surprised me initially but when I hear right wing rhetoric and wonder how people can actually believe some of that stuff I now think of Nancy. And there must be a lot of people out there like her.
grif: I don't know either; when you try to refute her as I've done, she frequently says, "It's true and I can give you a website where you can read all about it!" Of course she does; there's a website out there that can back up just about any outrageous far-out theory or "fact." And yes, fictitious Early Release Days sure do come in handy!
Deborah: It surprises me that some people just don't have a clue how to behave around other people, that they can reach a certain age and having been exposed to so many situations involving interaction with others, still not have any idea of what's appropriate and not. I know how you feel; I don't know if I could ever say that but you do get to a point sometimes where you want to.
Thoth: Nancy and I both are Catholic but in her case it seems to be in name only. She's taken it to a weird and unpleasant extreme that I usually don't associate with Catholicism. She does seem to have completely distorted what Jesus stood for and she's close-minded too which is ironic because catholic means "broad or comprehensive; liberal; all-inclusive."
Michelle: Thank you for that but I need all the help I can get! Just not from her, which is too bad because she's got such an optimistic, determined nature.
Abra: I don't know how people get so deluded, especially people you'd consider intelligent, who you'd think weren't susceptible to such crazy notions. It's not even that I don't respect her pro-life stance; it's the extreme she's taken it to and her zealousness about it. There is no redeeming true believers.
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⋆───★•❥Have a Lovely Day ☼ .¸¸.•*`*•.♥ (ツ)
I also feel so sorry for Nancy. I should be angry and disgusted by her, but the more I come to interact with people like that (and it's hard to avoid them in certain situations), the more I find that there is a human core to like about them, there's just something that's gone wrong. Usually ignorance is the culprit, or horizons that aren't broad enough. I wonder what her life was like growing up? Were her parents strict and religious, or is her way of life based on the fact that they weren't, and she wants to live differently? Has she travelled? Has she ever in any way had a personal interaction with a Muslim person? So many questions....
It's times like these that I understand women like Nancy: when I read or hear about them, I feel like I want to become a sort of crusade myself, educating them and allowing them to make informed decisions.
Also, I just read through the comments - good on you for going to another lunch with her, and not completely running away just yet. It'll be interesting to see how it goes....
Its too bad when we try to keep an open mind about someone and are blindsided by their true nature. Been there, wondered how I got it so wrong.
Alysa: I haven't EXACTLY ended the friendship. I'm like a hoarder that way; can't get rid of a friendship once it's in my collection. I don't know much about her upbringing yet other than she's from Chicago. But she is very welded to what she believes. I don't know how she got that way but she doesn't strike me as the type who'd be easy to reason with.
Mary: "Fear and mistruths" sure are powerful combos. And they spread like wildfire; they're swirling all around us right now.
Kelly: I know how you feel; I often feel the same way. I guess the key is deciding if other things about a relationship are worth valuing. If both people act like adults and can get accept their differences maturely then why not stay friends? I like reasonable discussions and have no problem seeing another's point of view; it's when they become strident and obnoxious that I tune out. You're not a bad person; you know your limits. Nothing wrong with that.
Various: Nancy would make a great recruiter; that's a good word for her. I can't remember the last time I met someone who was so passionate about what they believed to be the truth. But not so good at engagement, there's none of that with someone like her.
She blows all the stereotypes!
Usually, it's the hippies who hate vaccinations, the fundamentalists who are afraid of yoga, while the Catholics just hang their head in shame for being of such a fallen nature.
This woman is like a new religious species...wow. I'd keep the friendship, but follow her around and take notes, like she's Nature's experiment that she is...and write a dissertation one day.
Or an article for Vanity Fair.
Nancy could be the ticket to fame in scientific/Hollywood circles you've been looking for!
Do be careful. Crazy opinions are contagious.
Don't feel bad about liking this woman for reasons that may seem mysterious. Happens all the time. In a way, the workshop setting is like the internet--you get snapshots of people, not core samples.
i would never ever bring up this type of thing. But yet they do again and again. Nicely done Margaret.
Tom: Did you ever notice how if you add just one more "K" word to Kindergarten Kristian, say "Kooks" for example, you've got the KKK?
JT: Nancy's got it all sewn up in one neat little package, which is actually less threatening because it's like demons are channeling one person to speak through instead of a whole bunch. And don't worry, she's not contagious, at least not to me; I've already been vaccinated.
Sirenita: Hahaha, now I could never say that to anyone's face! Or could I? No I couldn't! I like the your "core sample" example. That's exactly what it was like when I had lunch with her and experienced her full-strength, undiluted self.
Bell: Another great zinger (like Sirenita's). I'm sure W is very likable in person, just like Reagan must have been and lots of others. Even Ted Bundy! But yeah, there are plenty of people with great personalities yet unacceptable beliefs. She probably feels the same way about me. How could she not - I have a GREAT personality. I know I do because I tell myself that all the time.
Rita: I don't understand either, about the "agenda" thing. I don't understand why some people just don't get it. Maybe they feel like they have to convince themselves, out loud and in front of others. Maybe they're on a mission to convert. It's hard to know; I feel as strongly about things as she does but I couldn't imagine continuously spouting off about them, making people uncomfortable. I guess some people have no "off" switch.
and not only is she anti everything perfectly rational and normal and PRIVATE (because these lunatics believe right down to their holy toesies that they're saving us from our hellbound selves), she implores us toPRAY for everyone and every thing. unfortunately the people she's praying for most for need it desperately......tiny little children, little rita. little malcom, little joe all of whom are falling apart literally in intensive care units. some of them die in my emails. this isn't funny. waking up to read about who's heart stopped last night is so sad. only I don't believe I can do anything. but she's met these kids when my grandson Cam was in the hospital this summer, she shmoozes with their parents and she is determined to rally her army of JC to save them and the rest of the world.
However, I am an atheist (ALSO her husband's mother so I figure that affords me something akin to a little leverage), so I gently asked her to please, please remove me from her mass email list which btw, gave MY email address to every one else... strangers who were now contacting me to pray for their person, place and thing needing my huzzahs. apparantly none of these people believe in BCCs. they DO believe in those emails that include images of kittens, puppies, babies in costume, various daisies, flags, christ standing over the twin towers...etc.
of course, she ignored me because being the mother of my grandchildren, SHE has leverage too.
damn.
(see...not even one mention of anal sex.)
Matt: It IS too late, unfortunately. It was too late long before I met Nancy. It was already too late the day I was born, Matt!
FM: "Holy toesies". Hahaha. Holy Moses! Oh my goodness how did your son get mixed up with someone like that! Does he feel the same way she does? Nancy also calls me up and asks me to pray for various people but she hasn't emailed me yet. I've never known a person like her before and she's fascinating and a little scary at the same time. I can only take her in small doses. Another friend of ours called me the other day to tell me she wasn't going to have anything to do with her anymore; she just can't take it. She says she thinks Nancy is literally crazy. You don't have that luxury. If anyone needed a good dose of anal sex, I think people like Nancy do - maybe that's their problem. Would it be inappropriate to suggest that? Probably.
Desnee: Sadly, I think converts is exactly what she's looking for. I don't know how long this "friendship" is going to last, especially since she's pleaded with me again to give Rush a listen. Hanging with her IS a lot like "fleas minus the dog." I don't think the dog would stick around.