MUSINGS FROM THE ICONOCLASM!

If I haven't dissed it--it ain't worth dissing!

Frank Apisa

Frank Apisa
Location
Piscataway, New Jersey, USA
Birthday
August 09
Bio
On a political continuum with Extreme Liberal at 1 and Extreme Conservative at 10, I can be found at position “P.” I get a chuckle at much of what passes for liberal thought, but don’t much chuckle at anything conservative. Quite frankly, I consider American conservatism to be one of the most dangerous pieces of garbage ever to pollute the planet Earth. A major problem with this mindset is occasioned by the fact that I am a 72 year old, white male who works at a county golf course in one of the richest, most conservative counties in the United States. Since I get free golf (at five county courses) as part of my compensation package, I play 4 – 5 times a week. Bottom line: Goddam near everyone I work with or play golf with, almost all of whom are 70+ year old white, males, is a die-hard conservative. I love each and every one of ‘em—love every bone in their heads. Truly! Sure is a tough haul, though—‘cause I am not given to holding my tongue. Just think of all the fun I have at work and play! Don’tcha envy me?

Frank Apisa's Links

Salon.com
FEBRUARY 2, 2012 9:00AM

WHY I AM SUPPORTING BARACK OBAMA!

Rate: 7 Flag

I just responded to a comment rwnutjob made...and I really do not want it to get lost, so I am repeating it here in a new thread.
 
 
 
  Frank Apisa is, unfortunately, like most Americans these days. As long as they are OK, then they can't let facts get in the way of reality. When the economy totally collapses and some of our big inner cities explode into horrific violence, then he may get a clue, but by then it's too late. 
 

RW…I am not avoiding facts—and may, in fact, be assessing such facts as exist with a bit less ideology than you. 

America did not get to where it is right now because of what Obama has done or not done. We are here after almost 45 years of relentless CONSERVATIVE domination of our economy and politics. From the day LBJ left office, almost every facet of American life has had CONSERVATISM as the dominant drive…and it has lead us to where we are. Liberalism and progressivism virtually died in the mid-1960’s. 

So…I advocate for lessening the influence of CONSERVATISM on the American political landscape as a means to finally break the cycle; and I see the re-election of Obama over the election of the eventual Republican nominee as the preferred move. 

If you do not see that, RW, I respectfully suggest you are the one refusing to let the facts get in the way of reality. 

But there is one thing we apparently do agree on. The only way people who are oblivious to the reality will ever wake up is when catastrophe occurs. The economy IS going to collapse, RW…and I am certain our big inner cities will explode into horrific violence. At that point, maybe the conservatives of this country will finally “get a clue”—because I expect that most of the anger will be directed at CONSERVATIVE excesses and shortsightedness. 

Whether it will be “too late” or not…neither of us knows. 

I might add, our choice of president will not do much more than delay the inevitable. Obama, Romney, Gingrich, Hillary…none will actually stop the slide. We need systemic change in the economic model to correct our dire predicament and we are not going to get that systemic change from a president. 

The sad fact is, we probably won’t get it without that catastrophic collapse we both see looming. 

 

If you have any response or reaction to my remarks, I hope you have your say over at RW's thread or here in this one.  

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This is a no-brainer. A Romney or Gingrich admin is unthinkable. r.
But we have another choice (besides me!! I know, wouldn't that be awesome if I was elected!! What? STOP ROLLING YOUR EYES!! :D)

An old wet sock found in the streets of DC!! According to ABC Polls, it has the best chance of beating them all, a third party, direly needed to combat the two horse dealers posing as Politicians for Whomever!!!

:)
Jonathan…the thought of another Republican administration truly is a horrible thought to contemplate. Thanks for stopping in.

Tink…the possibility of you or any other third party is (to put this as kindly as possible) remote. The “reality” as I see it is a choice between the nominee of the Democrats and the nominee of the Republicans. The nominee of the Republicans, in reality, WILL BE MUCH more conservative than the nominee of the Democrats…and since I see American conservatism as being very much at fault in our current predicament, I opt for the Democrat, Barack Obama. Thanks for commenting.

In any case, the reason I gave for supporting Obama up above, is only ONE OF THE REASONS I continue to support him.

As I have said in many threads, I also feel he has gotten done as much as possible considering the toxic political climate in which he has been working—and the political realities of the moment.

Just wanted to be sure that point be made.
I am totally on your side of the fence! Obama is not perfect, but he is far better than any of the alternatives. As for those who would vote for a third party candidate ---lets get real! Any vote for a third party candidate on either side, gives one less vote toward the lesser of the two evils!
I am not convinced that the economy will tank, only I think it is much worse and we are being given the rosy glasses and ....

I love Obama, but I agree. Bandaid. It'll take another 40+ years of new leadership local, state and national and the conservatives will not give it up. I think we are in a sever STALL economically and the 1970 stall will make this one look SEVER. Maybe when my 17 year old is my age- the economy and Conservatism will loosen up.

Love this post. Love your job. Really what a great benefit package!
I agree with Jonathan. If there's one fatal flaw in liberalism it's that so many adherents have an all or nothing attitude. In fact, that's a flaw with most all idealists, no mater which wing of the political spectrum they identify with. With right-wingers it's less a problem because the "values" they hold dear are more id derived, easier to sneak in under the radar of conscience.
"As I have said in many threads, I also feel he has gotten done as much as possible considering the toxic political climate in which he has been working—and the political realities of the moment."

Don't get me wrong, I'll be voting for Obama in 2012 as well, it took GW 8 years to start the ball rolling into the ground, Obama has only had less than four years to try and push it back up.

My brother and I were talking and he believes that Obama, in his second term, may become what the Change was all about, no worries, no fears about getting back in for a third term, tell those Democrats bickering among themselves to get aboard the O-Train or get kicked in the nuts! :)

I hope so, seriously, I do...

The Republicans would be funny if I didn't think they actually mean the stuff they say!! ~nodding~
Kenny…thanks for the comments. Glad we are of one mind in this area.

Mango…I think the economy is in much worse shape than you do…primarily because I see less and less reason to pay people a decent wage to do the kind of things most people can do. People are being replaced by the billions and billions of slaves represented by our advanced technology…the machines, computers, and robots. We’ll see.

As for the job…well, I played golf yesterday and the day before with just a light sweater on. The weather here in New Jersey is incredible considering we are in February!!!

Chicken…glad you see things as you do. I hope the liberals finally wake up and see that many of them are considering throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
Like you, I hope Tink. But I think this ball is rolling down a steep hill...and already has too much momentum to be stopped or reversed. I will be delighted if Obama can continue to slow the speed as he did in his first.

We'll see.
I just wish that there were a viable alternative. And failing that, I've got to stick with Obama.
Well here is one we do agree on Frank. People don't seem to remember that the worst of the depression hit after a four year pause while Wall Street skimmed as much as they could before the banks failed en masse in '33. 2013 might give us that total financial collapse and the blame can go at the feet of Reagan and his disciples. This one will be all the worse since Reaganomics allowed us to go from manufacturing to investment economy and let those corporations have false profits by way of selling off the U.S. industrial plant. Without industry to revive our nation we will end up either being wealthy offshore investors or the people who serve them drinks and cheeseburgers. Would you like fries with that?
I like Obama.

He inherited a busted economy. He inherited two idiotic wars.

I'm not going to apologize for anything the man has done.
You claim to be ASSessing facts, a claim you've brayed incessantly for over three years, yet you continue to say NOTHING about the heart of RW's post, which was:

"- Signed the NDAA - an indefinite detention bill - into law
- Waged war on Libya without congressional approval
- Started a covert, drone war in Yemen
- Escalated the proxy war in Somalia
- Escalated the CIA drone war in Pakistan
- Will maintain a presence in Iraq even after "ending" war
- Sharply escalated the war in Afghanistan
- Secretly deployed US special forces to 75 countries
- Sold $30 billion of weapons to the dictatorship in Saudi Arabia
- Signed an agreement for 7 military bases in Colombia
- Touted nuclear power, even after the disaster in Japan
- Opened up deepwater oil drilling, even after BP disaster
- Did a TV commercial promoting "clean coal"
- Defended body scans and pat-downs at airports
- Signed the Patriot Act extension into law
- Continued Bush's rendition program"

You alternately, sloganize that obama is a good and decent man, and without substantively addressing any of the above, blame his malevolence, alternately on the opposition or "professional liberals.

You unashamedly admit that you smoked FIVE or SIX joints a day for a long time, but ALWAYS took a day or two off a year; one of the most ASSinine admissions I've ever heard anyone make on OS.

You, also brag that YOU LOVE TO argue and are PROUD to have been banned from three boards.

You are a sick passive aggressive sociopath with few neurons left.

One more time:

"Therefore it is absolutely necessary that there should be full liberty to tell the truth about his (obama) acts, and this means that it is exactly necessary to blame him when he does wrong as to praise him when he does right. Any other attitude in an American citizen is both base and servile. To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - "Roosevelt in the Kansas City Star", May 7, 1918

How prescient of Mr. Roosevelt to imagine a cretin like fRANK, mr. base, servile, unpatriotic, and morally treasonable.

Morals are NOT a genus of mushrooms, nor do principles run schools, sycophant.

In one of your frequent bouts with transference, you accused someone who wrote a similar critique of what obama has done (NOT what obama has said) of being a lemming.

The "Urban Dictionary" defines lemming as: "1. lemming A member of a crowd with no originality or voice of his own. One who speaks or repeats only what he has been told. A tool. A cretin."

I notice that of recent times, you, of all people, have been prefacing some of your comments with the utterance "yo."
Hey Walter, thanks for stopping by. Glad you are sticking with Obama. The alternative is pap.

Bobbot…good to see you here. I voted for Reagan in 1980. I was sorely disappointed in Carter…and wanted to teach him a lesson. “What harm could come from Reagan getting in?, was my thought.

Boy, did I find out! We are all still paying for that mistake.

Nick…well said. I like him also…and considering the environment in which he has been working, you are right on saying there is nothing to apologize for.

RW…thanks for stopping in. The thoughts I expressed in your thread prompted this one. Looks like there is going to be some “nose holding” on both sides of the aisle. But I truly think your side will win, because most on your side will hold their noses and vote for the Republican…while I think a huge number on the left will go through with their threats to boycott the election or waste their vote on a third party candidate. I remember how determined I was to do that to teach Carter a lesson…and I see the same situation brewing right now. MY GUESS: Same result. The Republican gets wins.
Ditto to Nick Carraway's comment. ~r
Joan, thank you. And I agree...Nick was right on the button.
I have to wonder if anyone actually thinks we would have been better off with McCain/Palin. Really?
I also question whether anyone wants more of what happened the last time liberals and independents did not turn out strong to vote: Rick Scott, Scott Brown, Nikki Halley, Joe Walsh and on and on and on...
r./
Frank I think you check and mated RWnut but what do I know, I actually read and don't use FOX or Rush to interpret the world in which I live. I know the difference between reality and fairy tales too. That being said attempting to have a civil discourse with someone who doesn't know those differences, ends with them thinking they can bully you into believing what they believe.